Never at any time in my research and doctrinal interests have zombies, adultery, and murder ever remotely crossed my mind. It should be made clear that the denomination Brigham Young founded in 1851, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, has rejected these teachings. I do so realizing it could be the very thing that causes estrangement from my family, friends, and my church. . thousands of years for this day when Christians would awaken to the doctrine of May God continue to inspire you and bless you and your family, you are certainly blessings us! In my opinion Alma 5 and Alma 12, in their entirety, are both worthy of consideration along side many other scriptures that follow a pattern which is familiar to me. That is they aren't to be taken mystically or platonically but in a materialist/historicist kind of 'literalism.' The answers are there if you seek them from the Lord and in His timing. I must continually ask myself the question, Who am I to believe that Gods work is dependent on my understanding, teaching and attempting to enlighten the unenlightened? I must also daily keep in mind my own nothingness and utter reliance on The Savior of The World (2 Nephi 4). Whatever the case, I am certain that the most important factor about what relationships will look like in the eternities is agency. There were many things we did together as a couple and also individually that were in error of the doctrines of God as I have come to understand today. I met an individual who had seen me on one of those probationary Earths. The passage I was given is found in D&C 76 which also happens to be about the Mysteries of Godliness: D&C 76:41-44 Those who join are in serious jeopardy of losing their membership in The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, and also their eternal life, or exaltation, in the Celestial Kingdom of God. Another point on this, it is said in the bible that men like Adam, Methuselah, and Enoch were men who became perfect in their generation. That's the gist of it. Scriptures General Conference Come, Follow Me Gospel Library Media Library Music Library Life Help Inspiration. (Some received only Godhood.) The group is True LDS Deep Doctrines. 2:307 or TPJS, pp. This doctrine tastes delicious to me, and I glory in my God for His omniscience and almighty power to bring about our salvation and exultation in wonder and mysterious ways. idea as crazy or ridiculous. For some of us, the doctrine came along at a time we had Im sealed to my husband. Nor do I believe that a full understanding of Who I Am, in all the Eternal facets of my Being, qualifies me to take responsibility for doing Fathers work in somehow translating this knowledge to another. I love you all and am thankful for the puzzle piece of truth each of you has to offer in my journey. Interesting, interpretation. Having experienced the intense glory of Gods I thought I had reached the bottom of the rabbit holeI guess it goes deeper still. So beautiful and strong words that I saw citated by you and Greg this dynamic of dying and be born again. What is it? Thanks! I hold the knowledge sacred, personal to my own covenant were transfigured before him. Tonya, I didnt know this about your family. The Church Has a Bunker-Like Network of Tunnels. Ever since first hearing the doctrine of Multiple Mortal Probations, I have felt peace in this knowledge. I still struggle to understand my place in the eternitys. In words borrowed of the symbol of the baptism we will lay down our old body to receive a new one. I was once looking at the wickedness of the world and lamenting the fact that so few in this generation appear to be on a path to come to know Christ and therefore lacking what is needed to enter into His kingdom (JST Matt 7:33). D&C 132 on the other hand was dictated in 1843, prime time for this topic. 33:9. this life became a probationary state; a time to prepare, Alma 12:24. a probationary time, a time to repent and serve God, Alma 42:4. your days of probation are past, Hel. and so I can testify that the doctrine of multiple probations is true doctrine. [a] The Triumph and Glory of the Lamb: Doctrine and Covenants 76 in Its Historical Context Thomas asks if Zulema, Melanie Gibb, Lori were "very active" in the LDS Church. multiple lives, which to me is practical and actually very simplistic in In the light of the son every person is getting a form, visible to everyone around as they are becoming visible themselves the darkness will fadeas only the light has the power to vanish the darkness. I love truth wherever it is found. There is an answer. Now the doctrine of multiple probations brings me great peace. I asked the spirit and he said only once before. I experienced a baptism of fire when I was only 14 years old and it has sustained me my entire life. And as you mention that we are progressing to good or evil with every new morning the words of the philosopher Heidegger come into my mind. I cant mention this topic to my family, friends, or post about it on any platform, without incredible hurtful persecution. How tragic! This was part of a long prayer. Officially, Mormons are supposed to be almost entirely vegetarian. We all have to die to go further. Even when I was small, I felt that some spirits come to be tested and other (superior) spirits come to test! They are those who openly came into the presence of Christ and openly rejected what Christ is offering. Just think of the fun rides in life one could take though Ken! Thank you Ericfor putting what I know to be true into words. I simply found that it merited investigation. When I first heard this doctrine I felt a rush come over me that is hard to understand and explain. Following is the summary of the January 1846 Nauvoo Temple Record from the Multiple Mortal Probations document: Brigham Young laid hands on Heber C. Kimball and "Ordained him to the Godhead, and that he would act as the Savior to a world or worlds." Aloha brother. Ive wondered about past lives. Eric, As many have Thank You Eric, Beautifully expressed! I dont know perhaps I am wrong but it just came into my mind when I let the thought of multiple probations grow in my mind and heart. Alaris But there is some mystery here. Denver Carlos Snuffer Jr. is a Utah lawyer, an author of Restorationist devotional books, a lecturer, a speculative theologian, and claims to be a "revelator to fellowships of the remnants movement," a spiritual movement in schism with the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS Church). Its like the chorus which follows the verse, giving the song power and unity. Like Lehi who partook of the fruit of the tree of life and who immediately wanted to share it with his family, the fruits of the doctrine have been delicious to me, and I have also wanted to share it. Thank you sincerely for sharing this with us! . I just dont see how being promised we can be together forever, and being reborn in another life, and probably sealed to someone else fit together. But Icanlook upon thee in the natural According to orthodox Latter-day Saint teachings, this life is a test or probation to see if people will live by God's commandments. Seems to me that there is as much evidence for this reincarnation doctrine as there is for the Heavenly Mother doctrine. The thought that there could be no progression after judgment felt to contrast They will have to pay their debt to justice; they will suffer for their sins; and may tread a thorny path; but if it leads them at last, like the penitent Prodigal, to a loving and forgiving fathers heart and home, the painful experience will not have been in vain.. That stopped me in my tracks and I didnt know quite how to answer that. He wrote, "Jesus Christ spoke in this manner; I do as my Father before me did. These ware resurrected Bodies, Violated the Celestial laws. Thanks for sharing this interesting history. Shapes and forms can not be seen, but you can hear, sense and feel things Sometimes it seems to be the part of the day where one is in despairBut at that point, where no light can be seen the new day is already beginningSometimes it feels like only the hope of the rising sun (son) will carry you to the first sunbeam And when the sun or the son, as you call it, starts rising there come new possibilities or perspectives along. Oh how I love you and Julie and all that I have learned from you both!! It taught me that accepting such information and experiences with out, knowing for my self (James 1:5) was and is a danger zone for me to be in. consider to be an incomplete version of the Plan of Salvation by my faith. "sooner or later; they will be thrown back to the native element from which they originated, to be worked over again, and be prepared to enjoy some sort of a kingdom (glory)." The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. like my sweet wife. Just after the section discussing the Re. The church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints official stance on multiple mortal probations (similar to reincarnation) is that is the doctrine of the devil. We invite you to share this with all those you know who might benefit from it. As I have sought to understand my past before this life, and Having been so moved upon in the process of discovery, my friend Greg and I compiled a book called Multiple Probations which is a compilation of interesting history, supportive scriptures, and informative quotes from early authorities of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Callings Sharing the Gospel Volunteer and Serve Temples Family History. Adam Taking it as implying a loss of resurrection, a new fall, and a new veil of forgetfulness of course isn't in the text. It is not all to be comprehended in this world; it is a great thing to learn salvation beyond the grave. The seriousness, the risk, and the glories of mortal life are undercut the moment one supposes he will have a million or more subsequent probations of the same sort. Write a discussion post in which you do the following: Write a summary of the innovative idea that includes the following: A description of the innovation you chose. I was drawn to him because of these gifts that he freely shared with me. Strang, a convert of only four months at the time of Smith's martyrdom, produced a letter he claimed was sent by the prophet naming . And as this literally happens, every morning is a shadow of what will be in the long term of eternity. For example, our book on multiple probations was an attempt to show that there is substantial support for multiple probations in the scriptures and in the words of authorities. I welcome it! Most Mormons don't even know about this rule. The Whitney had high hopes his statement would pave the way for multiple probations to become church doctrine, and gave a copy to President Snow also: . Here is the relevant portion: they shall be heirs of God and joint heirs with Jesus Christ. Thank you for the clarity youre bringing to this doctrine. Is it not so, surely? (Moses 1). I have to be honest. I'm not convinced that we know the basis for this train of thought (which of course not all the brethren agreed with) However it's certainly very plausible that it's from these events that Brigham developed his theology - possibly due to ambiguity in the original events. Kalai, mahalo for visiting and sharing your views. And they who remain shall also be quickened; nevertheless, they shall return again to their own place [the telestial kingdom where they now live], to enjoy that which they are willing to receive, because they were not willing to enjoy that which they might have received.". (There were for a while more Mormons in England than Utah) It's true that several apostles believed in such matters and you're right that they fell out of favor in the early 20th century. Considering the modern Mormon understanding of the titles Jehovah and Elohim didn't develop until long after Brigham Young, it is understandable that he could have developed his own interpretation of Micheal, Jehovah and Elohim. I dont want to repeat 5th grade again. church. Even if I lived to be 100 years old I am quite certain I will not know everything God knows. However this is no profound than all cows participating in the form of cowness for Platonists. Nor do I believe that a full understanding of Who I Am, in all the Eternal facets of my Being, qualifies me to take responsibility for doing Fathers work in somehow translating this knowledge to another. As I am learning and beginning to understand more of multiple probations, eternal progression, ascension and condescension, I am seeing a much larger picture in the eternal realm of learning and progression. It has been reported by those who knew the first prophet of the church that he was at least at one. Blessings to all seekers. Couldnt we just come again and again until we got it right? Thanks for your courage to share. Thank you Kim. We and our partners store and/or access information on a device, such as cookies and process personal data, such as unique identifiers and standard information sent by a device for personalised ads and content, ad and content measurement, and audience insights, as well as to develop and improve products. Adam-God can then be seen as based on JS' teachings and the endowment, with a simple fundamental misunderstanding on the identity of Micheal in the Godhead. February 28, 2017 in General Discussions. Despite the comments and quoted references that say Joseph taught reincarnation, I do not see any of his doctrine that teaches it. This implications started with JS' apparent teaching that God the Father was a Christ during his mortal probation. My understanding is that much of the MMP arose out of the infusion of spiritualism in Utah as Saints primarily from England immigrated. grudge against anyone who does not believe, or who does not want to know more I was cautious at first with excitement, but, put it on a shelf. but it is necessary to know in the context of my exaltation. "And also they who are quickened by a portion of the telestial glory shall then receive of the same, even a fulness. Let's review multiple scriptures that allow us to see things as they really are: 1) The Plan of Happiness. Laub wrote, "For we are to go from glory to glory and as one is raised to a higher, so the next under him may take his degree and so to take the exaltation through the regular channel. We say that one has to go to the grave to be born again in Christ. In D&C 132:55 where the Lord is speaking of Joseph Smith he says, and I will bless him and multiply him and give unto him an hundred-fold in this world, of fathers and mothers, brothers and sisters, houses and lands, wives and children, and crowns of eternal lives in the eternal worlds. It appears to me that children, and crowns of eternal lives are two different things. There is always hope in Christ. Knowing what the Lord has trusted me I am a witness that these promises are true. Benjamin Seeker Also, I didn't mention it in the OP, but I believe Michael Quinn documents an influential relationship between JS and Alexander Neibaur, who was a convert from Jewish Cabala and who related reincarnation-like Cabala sourced ideas in a couple of Times and Seasons articles during the Nauvoo era. Eric, That being said I am personally bound by the admonition given in countless times and ways throughout scripture and most clearly in the Doctrine and Covenants 63: 64. In 1786, a guy named John Zephaniah Holwell published a tract called "Dissertation on the Origin of Intelligent Beings, and on Divine Providence".I recommend it to anybody curious about the ideas of a premortal existence, war in heaven, plan of salvation, opposition in all things, infant baptism, free agency, multiple mortal probations, etc. Im glad you feel that way Kendall. Thanks for sharing! Until I meet you. Oh, and another thing, so many on this board have mentioned how attaining Godhood is much better than living as angels and playing harpsin the clouds doing nothing. Hallelujah! Your recent podcasts and inspired book, Multiple Probations, also shed so much light on this topic and are the sources of which I seek to learn more. Some awesome people have been excommunicated. Thank you for sharing this. One of the purposes of this book is to outline basic doctrines and explain how missionaries should teach them. Libraries. Because we are told this is the time for men to prepare to meet God, Yea behold , I find I am perplexed it seems we are being told in more than this scripture, that THIS TIME is the time from which we attain our eternal status, NOT THROUGH OUR OWN TOTAL EFFORTS, but from our leaning on the atonement of Christ. we are talking about multiple mortal probations that are all human.] In the years since my witness of the Doctrine of Multiple Probations has increased considerably, I embrace it with eagerness. How can eternal progression happen in one lifetime on this earth. clarity to the many dreams, visions, memories, and Deja vu experiences that idea that a person would live their life on earth and then be permanently That is so very sad but I am thankful for that. Something that has always been there but was never realized by me. They went to the temple quite often and met up with each other there. My only doubt was in me and the ability to live the gospel of Jesus Christ. . These secret teachings coincided with teachings by Joseph that either explicity stated or implied that previously resurrected beings, essentially from a prior earth, could interact with mortals on this earth. The dramatic change from light to Something didnt feel complete and this connects so many pieces in my life, in my culture, and even in our Hawaiian legends of gods and goddesses. This concept was taught by early LDS Church leaders. You know that the LDS church doesn't even believe in past lives, or "multiple probations", and there is a long list of other problematic ideas that Chad, Julie, Lori and the rest cooked up that is not in accordance to LDS doctrine. Yet the words of Isaiah, which were so plain and simple to Nephi, tend to mystify the Latter-day Saints. I will ponder about it and ask Heavenly Father. This thesis explains a bunch of odd data points and suggests a straightforward explanation for the origin of Adam-God. The Widow's Mite presents, an overview of Church land ownership in the USA. Greg pointed out another of these natural and likely divine reminders and shadows to me, in the daily rising and setting of the sun. One lifetime and you are done feels like temporary progression. Single Probation Doctrine, and Mortal Experience. I must continually ask myself the question, Who am I to believe that Gods work is dependent on my understanding, teaching and attempting to enlighten the unenlightened? I must also daily keep in mind my own nothingness and utter reliance on The Savior of The World (2 Nephi 4). Prescendia Huntington Buell (later Kimball) also affirmed her belief in "plural probations," referring to a statement "in confirmation" by her polyandrous husband Joseph Smiths. Over the past few years it has been my privilege, as well as many who I know, to have naturally and individually come upon the doctrine recently called Multiple Probations. Ok so if we are going to be Christs of other worlds then do we have to go through all the suffering Jesus went through in Gethsemane and on the cross? Question. It gives context for the possibility that aborted and miscarried babies, or even inexperienced humans who leave the world prematurely can still have a shot at life and prove themselves (Abraham 3:25).
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